I'm sorry, Doug, if you felt I was a little hard on you in class today; however, I want you (and everyone in the class) to understand that the sort of intellectual lassitude that served you well enough in your sophomore year will not stand now that you are juniors in an Advanced Placement course.
To say that (and I'm paraphrasing here), "This guy isn't worth reading because he's not saying anything that others haven't said before" is simply not a legitimate response until: 1) You let me know that you understand what he is actually saying, and 2) You reference (specifically) who these others are who have preceded him, and how their opinions are exactly the same. Moreover, prefacing this sort of statement with the observation that the author 'lived in Kansas in the 17th century' cuts your credibility off at the knees—and would get you laughed out of a college seminar (forget the fact that, whether you agree with him or not, Thoreau's seminal influence on activist such as Martin Luther King and Gandhi would seem to make him 'worth reading'—if for no other reason than to try and figure out just what he was saying).
Again, my intent here is not to stifle discussion. Far from it. But I want our discussions to be informed by the readings. As Kelsey tried to argue the other day, you are entitled to your own opinion; but along with that liberty comes the possibility that your opinion may be wrong—"wrong" in this case simply meaning that that opinion is unsupportable by the text under review (or, worse, no attempt is even made to support said opinion with reference to the text). Gone are the days when a vague generalization ("Emerson likes Nature" or "Whitman was a crazy guy")—an observation too often prompted not by a close reading of the text, but by passing attention paid to our discussion of it—will suffice.
I've already seen ample evidence (in your blog posts and in your responses to the "Divinity School Address") that each and every one of you is capable of the intellectual rigor of which I speak. So, in your posts for Monday, please make an effort to ground your responses in language lifted from the authors you are discussing.
Have a great weekend!
P.S. While your post is worth (up to) a standard 20 points, those who comment on this post will receive 5 points of extra credit!
I definitely agree with you that all of us need to step up a bit more this year than we have been used to. It will take us, or at least me, time to adjust to the transition, this course as well as our many other rigorous courses this year require us to do more than understand cut and dry facts. We need to interpret, analyze, and discuss on a level that not all of us are used to or familiar with. I look forward to challenging myself and in turn growing as an intellectual throughout this year.
ReplyDeleteThanks for your thoughts, Emma (yes, they're worth an extra five points of extra credit!).
ReplyDeleteI agree with both of you. I liked that you and Doug were fighting because I think that it shows that Doug has the ability to stand up for his opinions although they may be wrong where as many of us are scared to say the wrong thing. I hope that I can accomplish this kind of thinking quickly. I remember what you said in the beginning of the year of one of the writers that he had to write down what he was thinking in order to understand what he was thinking. I agree with that and I need to do that more often, which I htink blogging about it is awesome because it helps with what I am trying to say. Thanks. =)
ReplyDeleteMr. Lavender, all the things you said is exactly what the student body needs to start doing. we all, including myself, need to stop thinking that we know everything without even looking at the facts. I personally feel that the "discussion" in class between you and doug was extremely beneficial to the class. Both had good arguments and the outcome that i had was a good one. Whenever i sit down to blog about the given topics my mind draws a blank and i find myself rambling on about nonsense. I think it would help if we talked about in class how to make our blogs more interesting and thought provoking.
ReplyDeletethanks
Although I was not in class for this heated debate, I can only imagine you and Doug going at it. But yes I do agree this is an important issue with much of this class. As we continue through high school it is inevitable that we give up our wimpy arguments unless we have good solid backing and support. As a senior I can say that from experience you can not fly through your years with inferior knowledge of a certain subject and without the ability to reference the source. Its too bad I missed this argument. Would have been interesting to listen to.
ReplyDeleteEven though i do agree with Doug, the fact that Thoraue did not spend as much time in nature, tucked away in the serenity of the woods, i also agree with you Mr. Lanvender. Even though we are entitled to our own opinions, they need to be first supported. The discussions in class on Friday really got me thinking Mr. Lavender. It got me thinking about how every one in the world has some form of biast, like you and Emerson have said. Most people think one thing about anything they hear. News is just Gossip, and the entire population of the world contributs to this satement.
ReplyDeleteAgain, great comments from each of you. Thanks!
ReplyDelete[again, this one's actually from Ali...]
ReplyDeleteI agree with both of you. Like Emma said, it is very important that we stay on top of our classes and learn to expect that we have to take a lot more time to read things, than our past years. This is a big year, and we have to put all of effort in, because this is basically the year that determines our college career, or the pathway to it. In addition to Chancee's post, it was great that Doug stood up for his opinion, but when arguing something, it is important that you have concrete background info on the person or subject to back yourself up. Nonetheless, i enjoyed watching you and Doug debate about your opinions and facts. It made it very clear to me that you have to think things through before you make a statement. It kind of changed my person perspective on how I interpret and analyze information.
Thank you.
I agree with you all too much Mr. Lavender
ReplyDeleteOur generation pulls way too much shit out of our ass. We are not the first generation to pull shit out of our as but we are the only generation that feels so self-richeous and rebelious when we do it. We make up philosophies, critize everything, and fight even the slightest hint of oppression as if we were enslaved, which is all wonderfull, but we have no real basis for our arugment. We never have facts, we rarely know the backround, and for gods sake we never look at it from the other side which is a serious flaw. Our generation is far too stand up and rebelious no matter what were defending or ho wpoorly we form our arguments.
This year is for sure a step up from Sophomore year. No longer can we just fly through and bull shit our way through assignments. This has been really hard for me to learn, but beneficial at the same time. The in class discussion(or should I say argument) between you and Doug made an impressive and necessary point for all of us. I can understand where Doug was coming from in some sense but also feel like your points were completely true. Students need to learn more background before they jump to conclusions. This was just one example of how this is an Advanced Placement class, not just another required credit. Hopefully we can all learn from this.
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